Senator McLUCAS (Queensland) (14:12): My question is to the Minister for Indigenous Affairs, Senator Scullion. I refer to this year's budget papers, which confirm: … net savings of $534.4 million over five years through efficiencies resulting from the rationalisation of Indigenous programmes, grants and activities … I also note the minister's statement on ABC radio, when he said: 'There are no cuts at all.' Which is correct—the budget papers or the minister?