Senator CORMANN (Western Australia—Minister for Finance, Vice-President of the Executive Council and Leader of the Government in the Senate) (14:01): What the government can guarantee is that we will continue to ensure that, if people fail to come to an arrangement to settle their debts, the government has a responsibility to taxpayers to recover the money, as said by Tanya Plibersek. Of course, we know that Mr Shorten supported the automation of this process and we know that Chris Bowen also supported that principle. I guess we're hearing the Labor Party essentially suggesting that, when payments are made to people in excess of what they should have been, the government should just walk away and leave it. Opposition senators interjecting— The PRESIDENT: Order on my left! Senator CORMANN: We should just make overpayment after overpayment. If that is the position of the Labor Party, the Labor Party should spell it out. The PRESIDENT: Order! When I call senators to order, the informal rule is they must count to 10 before they start inappropriately interjecting again.