Senator KIM CARR (Victoria—Minister for Human Services) (14:34): I thank Senator Furner for his question. This is one that rightly every senator and every member is entitled to ask. As we are obviously strongly focused on the issues of people waiting to get service it is a matter of considerable concern to this government. At the moment the Department of Human Services is taking 150,000 phone calls a day—this is Centrelink alone—and is making some 38 million phone calls in the space of a year. Senator Joyce interjecting— Senator Conroy interjecting— Senator KIM CARR: So demand is extremely high and it is growing and, as a consequence, Senator Joyce, waiting times are in fact rising. Senator Joyce interjecting— Senator Conroy interjecting— The PRESIDENT: Order! Senator Carr, resume your seat. Senator Joyce and Senator Conroy, I remind you that interjections across the chamber are disorderly. There have been repeated occasions where I have reminded you of this today. The minister is entitled to be heard in silence. Senator KIM CARR: This is no reflection on the professional staff at call centres or those who support them in back offices; it is simply a reality of Public Service delivery today. We are dealing with the volatility of the global economy; we are dealing with some 150 changes in the social security system that have arisen from the improvements made by this government in the last budget; we are dealing with many more Australians who are on part pensions and have to report their income changes to the department; we are dealing with calls which are of a much higher level of complexity. We are also dealing with a situation where we have claims by the Liberal Party that they are going to take some 12,000 public servants out of the Commonwealth Public Service in the first two years of a Liberal government. Imagine what that is going to do to waiting times. Imagine what that is going to do to the capacity to respond to the legitimate needs of the Australian people during periods of considerable economic change. Average waiting times are about 12 minutes and we are concerned that that time is growing. But taking 12,000 people out won't improve it. (Time expired)