Mr SHORTEN (Maribyrnong) (14:36): My question is to the Minister for Government Services. I refer to his answer yesterday concerning the tragic suicide of robodebt victim Jarrad Madgwick. I spoke to Kath, his mum, last night, and she asked me to ask, 'Can the minister explain how chasing Jarrad for almost $2,000 has been a sound economic decision given that Jarrad and I would have full employment now, but, due to my grief, PTSD and depression, I'm forced to rely on the welfare system?' Minister, what is the answer?