Senator FARRELL (South Australia—Minister for Trade and Tourism, Special Minister of State and Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) (14:15): Thanks to Senator Canavan for his question. After a wasted decade, today is a very good day. We are legislating for a 43 per cent reduction, and today's changes are how we are going to deliver that. The safeguards will be a clear, stable and commonsense framework for reducing emissions. and the only chance in this parliament to reduce emissions of the biggest 215 emitters in this country. We thank businesses right across Australia, and particularly the Greens today, for their constructive dialogue. If the opposition have got some concerns about this particular policy, then they could have— Senator Birmingham: President, again, a point of order on direct relevance. Senator Farrell likes to go through the background part of a brief. These points of order actually give him time to come to the specific question that was asked. So, as he flicks through the pages in front of him, could we please draw him to Senator Canavan's very specific question about whether future projects will have their scope 1, scope 2 and scope 3 emissions for domestic use required to be offset? Will they, or won't they? The PRE SIDENT: I believe the minister is being relevant but I will listen. That question was very detailed. Yes, it had a direct ask at the end, but it was also very detailed. Senator FARRELL: The reality is this. At some point it must strike the coalition that when you deal yourself out of the— The PRESIDENT: Senator Birmingham on a point of order? Senator Birmingham: Again, President, direct relevance: the question went to a substantive matter of policy, not to whatever the minister wants to say about the opposition but to a substantive question of policy. Please draw him to the policy. The PRESIDENT: Thank you, Senator Birmingham. I will certainly draw the minister to the question. Senator FARRELL: The reality is that at some point you've got to understand, when you deal yourself out of the picture by refusing to negotiate— The PRESIDENT: Senator Birmingham on a point of order? Senator Birmingham: President, you did just draw the minister to the question. He is flaunting your ruling, ignoring your ruling, showing disregard. I urge you to please be proactive in reminding him of that or, if need be, sitting him down if he continues to ignore you. The PRESIDENT: Senator Birmingham, I have drawn the minister to the question. Minister, I ask you to direct yourself to the— Honourable senators interjecting— The PRESIDENT: Conversations across the chamber are disorderly! I called the minister to the question. I am going to call the minister to answer the question. Senator FARRELL: Thank you, President. I completely reject the suggestion that I don't respect the chair, because I do. The safeguard framework will help deliver the commitment of scope 1 emissions. Given the cross-jurisdictional nature of scopes 2 and 3 emissions, the government will refer scope 2 and 3 emissions to the Energy and Climate Ministerial Council. The PRESIDENT: Senator Canavan, your first supplementary?