Senator CORMANN (Western Australia—Leader of the Government in the Senate, Minister for Finance, Special Minister of State and Vice-President of the Executive Council) (14:47): I would advise the honourable senator not to just accept all questions from the tactics committee, and then perhaps, if he is given questions by the tactics committee, to actually listen to the answer, because that question completely ignores everything that I've said so far. Firstly, $30 billion out of that $65 billion you are backing in. That's No. 1. Let me tell you something else. For you to claim a $65 billion tax giveaway to big business, you must think that 100 per cent of all businesses in Australia are big businesses. Do we think that 100 per cent of all businesses are big? Government senators: No! Senator CORMANN: No, they're not. Do we want all businesses in Australia to aspire to become a big business? Government senators interjecting— The PRESIDENT: Order on my right! Senator CORMANN: Yes, we do. We want every small business to become a bigger business and we want— The PRESIDENT: Senator Cormann, please resume your seat. Senator Collins, on a point of order. Senator Jacinta Collins: Mr President, the point of order is relevance. The minister has been asked now three times, 'What rate of growth?' and he refuses to answer. The PRESIDENT: The minister is being directly relevant to the question as asked. Senator Cormann. Senator CORMANN: I mean really—all hope is lost for the modern-day Labor Party. When they don't understand when I say that we are not centrally prescribing— (Time expired)