Senator BIRMINGHAM (South Australia—Minister for Education and Training) (14:08): The government will have more to say, as the Prime Minister made very clear today, in relation to education policy before the election, and that will be clear for all Australians. I would draw Senator Carr's attention to the reality of the PBO report. That report highlights the fact that the expanse of, and growth in, the HELP scheme is largely attributable to the decisions— Senator Kim Carr: No, that is not right. It said 'mainly your policy'. The PRESIDENT: Order! Senator Carr, you have asked your question. Senator BIRMINGHAM: Don't burst a button on your waistcoat, Senator Carr! That report says that growth is largely attributable to changes in relation to the demand-driven scheme and is very much attributable to the VET FEE-HELP debacle that those opposite oversaw. Those opposite come in and talk about the expected blow-out in unpaid debt in relation to the HELP scheme, but a very heavy debt weighs on their shoulders as a result of the policy decisions that they made when they were in office. We are attempting to clean that up. We have been working very hard to clean that up in relation to the VET FEE-HELP scheme. We have had to put in place, as the PBO report also recognises, a freeze in relation to the level of VET FEE-HELP debt in place this year so that we can make sure we do stop the growth in those bad debts, that we do get it under control, and we will certainly ensure that we continue on such measures to keep debt under control in the future.