Senator WONG (South Australia—Minister for Finance and Deregulation) (14:53): I am pleased that the senator has asked me this question. It gives me the opportunity to respond to the modelling and also to the second part of the question, which deals with the carbon pricing. In relation to the level of the carbon price, which is the end of this question, the government has designed a period of a fixed price followed by a floating price. It is the case that the carbon price in Europe has been affected by current financial conditions in Europe. That is unsurprising, but I would again make this point: the government is providing a very substantial amount of assistance through the Jobs and Competitiveness package to Australian industry, and it is wrong simply to look at price without recognising also the very significant elements to support competitiveness that the government has in its package. In relation to modelling, it is true that there is modelling out there that has been commissioned by various parties, various individuals and various industries. Unsurprisingly, that modelling is often used by people to promulgate their particular position. The government stands by the Treasury modelling—the modelling done by the people who served, so ably, Peter Costello and John Howard; the people who now serve this government—which shows that we can grow our economy, grow our incomes and grow jobs with a carbon price. Senator Joyce: Mr President, on a point of order on relevance: does the minister believe it will have a negative impact on Australia's growth because the carbon price is so vastly higher than overseas, or doesn't she? The PRESIDENT: There is no point of order. That is part of the question you asked. Senator Wong is addressing the question. Senator WONG: Clearly the senator might have his mind on other matters, because he interrupted me just as I was talking about economic growth. I was talking about the fact that the Treasury has clearly indicated that we can grow the economy with a carbon price. But, of course, what they do not say on the other side is the fact that their policy will cost more. It was cost taxpayers more and it will cost the economy more. That will have the effect on growth.