Senator WONG (South Australia—Minister for Finance and Deregulation) (14:51): I welcome the question from the senator in part because it confirms that Senator Ludwig has seen off the opposition's series of attacks on him well and truly but also because I welcome the opportunity— Senator Conroy: Withering attacks. Senator WONG: I am not sure that 'attack' was quite the right word— The PRESIDENT: Come to the question. Senator WONG: Let's say a series of questions. I am also very happy to discuss— Opposition senators interjecting— Senator Conroy interjecting— The PRESIDENT: Senator Wong, just come to the question please. Senator WONG: I am trying, Mr President. But there are a great many interjections from that side and I can understand why because on this issue it is somewhat embarrassing the extent of the division on that side, including by Senator Humphries. I am surprised that Senator Humphries is even asking this question. I thought he was one of the few on that side who actually thought climate change was real. The government has been very clear in its approach to action on climate change: that a carbon price is the cheapest, fairest way to ensure we reduce the carbon pollution that is causing climate change or contributing to climate change and also to drive investment in a clean energy future. It is the case that we have said the carbon price will be paid by less than a thousand of the largest polluters for every tonne of pollution they emit and that we will take every cent taken from the big polluters to provide generous household assistance, to help with family budgets, to protect jobs as businesses make the transition to a clean energy economy, and to tackle climate change including by investing in new and clean technology. Senator Brandis: Mr President, a point of order on the question of relevance: the minister has only 20 seconds to go. She has been going for one minute and 40 seconds and she has not anywhere near approached the topic of the question—that is, what proposals the government has for the compensation of fixed income earners, in particular self-funded retirees. Abuse of the opposition and a recitation of the general principles behind the government's policy are not directly relevant. It was a narrow and specific question and it ought to be answered. The PRESIDENT: There is no point of order. Senator WONG: Clearly, Senator Brandis does not understand how a carbon price works, because the very point of ensuring you impose a price on the big polluters and you use that revenue to assist Australian households goes directly to the household assistance issue that the senator has raised—unlike your policy, which is about taxing Australian households and giving the money to Australia's biggest polluters. How is that fair? (Time expired)