Senator FARRELL (South Australia—Minister for Trade and Tourism, Special Minister of State and Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) (14:47): I thank Senator McGrath for his first supplementary question. Look, I don't think I can make it any clearer than I have already made it. We understand that— Senator Scarr: You're incapable. The PRESIDENT: Minister Farrell, please resume your seat. Senator Scarr, I would ask you to withdraw that personal reflection. Senator Scarr: I withdraw. The PRESIDENT: Minister Farrell, please continue. Senator FARRELL: I actually didn't hear it but thank you for— Senator McKenzie: Turn up your hearing aids. Senator FARRELL: Oh, give us a break. Look, we do understand the pressure that ordinary Australians are under as a result of these rising interest rates. If you hadn't mismanaged the economy so badly, so badly, under the nine years that you were part of the former— The PRESIDENT: Senator McGrath, on a point of order? Senator McGrath: I rise on a point of order on direct relevance. The question was very tightly written. It goes to how many households are currently experiencing mortgage stress. It's asking for a number. The minister is not going near the question. I ask you to direct him back to the question, please. The PRESIDENT: I will direct the minister to the question. Minister. Senator FARRELL: Well, I can only reiterate time and time again we understand the problem of higher interest rates. We understand the problem. We're seeking to do things in the economy that we have control of— (Time expired) The PRESIDENT: Senator McGrath, a second supplementary?