Ms GILLARD (Lalor—Prime Minister) (14:47): Point No. 1: I refer the member who asked the question to everything that I have said in question time about the resourcing of our security agencies, including the increased resourcing in ASIO. I ask him, if he is capable of doing so, to absorb the facts. No. 2: in terms of proposals for cutting back national security efforts, the one that is clearest in my mind is the Leader of the Opposition's proposal to reduce the public sector by 20,000, pointing to 20,000 growth as unacceptable and therefore pointing to a growth in ASIO, AFP and Defence personnel— Mr Randall: Madam Speaker, I rise on a point of order on relevance. I asked the question in relation to the evidence of the Senate estimates committee and about her position, not the Leader of the Opposition's— The SPEAKER: The member for Canning will resume his seat. The Prime Minister will be relevant to the question before the Chair. Ms GILLARD: I was asked about security resourcing and I am being relevant to that section of the question. I am saying that I think it is a good thing that we have more Defence personnel than we used to. I think it is a good thing that we have more reservists than we used to. It is a good thing that we have more AFP than we used to. And it is also a good thing that there are more people employed in ASIO than there used to be. I would certainly not be advocating, as others in this parliament have, that that should be cut to the bone. On the question of notification of police, police can always get information which they require. I refer the member to the shadow minister for immigration who, at an earlier point this year, floated a proposal for notification of communities. When the shadow Treasurer was asked about this proposal the best he could say was, 'That is an issue for debate.' When the member for McMillan was asked about this proposal he said that the kind of vilification— The SPEAKER: The Prime Minister will resume her seat. The Manager of Opposition Business: a point of relevance has already been taken. Mr Pyne: Madam Speaker, on another point of order on relevance. You have asked the Prime Minister to answer the question. She was asked whether she agreed that the whereabouts of illegal migrants should not be disclosed for privacy reasons— The SPEAKER: The Manager of Opposition Business will resume his seat. The Prime Minister has the call. Ms GILLARD: I have indicated that police can get the information they need and I am now going to reactions to proposals about notifications. The proposal was put out by the shadow minister for immigration. The shadow Treasurer distanced himself from it— Mr Morrison interjecting— The SPEAKER: The member for Cook! Ms GILLARD: The member for McMillan described it as the kind of vilification of asylum seekers that is unacceptable in this nation. Senator Brandis denied ever discussing it with the shadow minister for immigration. Parliamentary secretary Scott Ryan said that he is not familiar with the detail, and it all ended up with a rather embarrassing admission from Tony Jones that it was the shadow minister's proposal—his own proposal—and he acknowledged that on the opposition benches people were not prepared to stand alongside it. So if we are going to have this kind of material put before the House then let us have all of it put before the House, including that members of the opposition have been revolted by policy suggestions put forward by the shadow minister for immigration, and for good reason.