Senator BIRMINGHAM (South Australia—Minister for Education and Training and Manager of Government Business in the Senate) (14:29): In relation to the specific projections about the future mix and composition of the generation markets, I am happy to provide further information to the senator if I can. But certainly in relation to the modelling, as I've already highlighted to the senator, the modelling makes very clear that there are savings to be achieved for households and businesses across Australia and that those savings are quite significant. Australian households can expect to see a projected saving in the order of $550 as a result of the implementation of the National Energy Guarantee. That of course translates into thousands of dollars for small businesses, medium-sized businesses and large businesses, all of which will benefit from the extra certainty the National Energy Guarantee will provide as well as from the lower energy prices. The National Energy Guarantee itself is part of the government's technology-neutral approach in terms of our support for energy development in Australia. We want to make sure that energy development is at the lowest price and that it is absolutely as reliable as is required to provide certainty for Australian businesses and households so that, when they flick the switch, the power will be there. And we want to make sure that we meet our international obligations. But, unlike those opposite, we're not into picking winners; we're into ensuring that we have a technology-neutral approach to the way in which the policies are applied. The PRESIDENT: Order, Senator Birmingham. Senator Marshall on a point of order? Senator Marshall: I only asked one question, and it was a specific question. It was about the government's modelling and whether the government could confirm that it will deliver no new coal generation between 2022 and 2030. That's all I asked. The PRESIDENT: Thank you, Senator Marshall. You've kindly reminded Senator Birmingham of the question. He has 32 seconds remaining to answer. I note he said he will provide further information as part of his answer, but he has 30 seconds remaining to answer the question. Senator Cameron: He knows everything else about it but that. The PRESIDENT: Senator Cameron, while I'm talking, please! Senator Birmingham. Senator BIRMINGHAM: Yes, indeed I did indicate that we could bring back further information if required. I can certainly inform the senator that the Australian Energy Market Operator's Integrated System Plan highlights the transition that's underway in the national energy market but, importantly, that low-cost thermal generation clearly is expected to remain an important part of our energy mix, including coal and natural gas, which produced some 87 per cent of total electricity generated in the NEM in 2017. And estimates are that there will continue to be very strong demand and requirement for such generation. (Time expired) The PRESIDENT: Senator Marshall, a supplementary question.