Ms GILLARD (Lalor—Prime Minister) (14:19): I confirm again to the parliament and to the Leader of the Opposition the information that was made available to the opposition through Senate estimates and that it should know. That information is that the Treasury modelling assumes that nations hold to the lower end of their pledges for reducing carbon pollution. This moment very much reminds me of when the Leader of the Opposition got himself in a huge mess when he was out and about at a public meeting describing Australia's minus-five-per-cent target as 'crazy', whereas at the same time his blogs—I think on Mamamia—praised the fact that the Liberal opposition actually had bipartisan support for that target. Of course, that minus-five-per-cent target is what Australia has pledged it will do by 2020. My understanding, unless something has happened this morning, is that that is supported by the Leader of the Opposition. What is being done in the Treasury modelling— Honourable members interjecting— The SPEAKER: Order! When the House comes to order, the Leader of the Opposition on a point of order. Mr Abbott: Yes, Mr Speaker. The relevant statement is: The modelling assumes comparable carbon pricing in other major economies from 2015-16 … The SPEAKER: Order! The Leader of the Opposition is raising direct relevance. I know that the Prime Minister is aware of that and I caution the Prime Minister that less debate, which still could be directly relevant to the question, would assist. The Prime Minister has the call. Ms GILLARD: Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. I went to Australia's reduction target for 2020 to give the parliament and the Leader of the Opposition an example of a nation—Australia—that has made an unconditional pledge to reduce its carbon pollution. We have made an unconditional pledge to reduce our carbon pollution by five per cent. What the Treasury modelling does is assume that other countries meet their low-end pollution reduction targets for 2020 as well. The opposition knows that when it is not on a campaign of misrepresentation. That has been gone through at Senate estimates. That is a fact available to the opposition. In terms of the position of the United States of America, it was verified by President Obama in this parliament last Thursday when he restated the commitment of the United States of America to the reduction target that it has announced. The Leader of the Opposition, I understand, is trying to do everything he can to continue his campaign of negativity, but he cannot live in denial of the facts, and the facts are as I have just explained them to the Leader of the Opposition. For him to say anything else or to do anything else is simply to mislead the Australian people.