Senator GALLAGHER (Australian Capital Territory—Minister for the Public Service, Minister for Finance, Minister for Women, Manager of Government Business in the Senate and Vice-President of the Executive Council) (14:01): I was wondering where we were going with that. Senator Hume was outlining support for the policy that they now have changed their position on— Senator Hume: The lie— The PRESIDENT: Order! Senator Hume, withdraw. Senator Hume: I withdraw. Senator GALLAGHER: I might start my answer by referring to the comment of the deputy opposition leader, Sussan Ley, from yesterday which was: 'You wouldn't expect me to pull out one ingredient or one part of tax reform, so I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to play the, 'Yes, this is good— Senator Hume: President, I raise a point of order on relevance. I didn't ask about Ms Ley. I asked about a commitment that Labor made. The PRESIDENT: The minister's just started her response, so I will wait and see where it goes. Senator Wong: President, on the point of order, I again make the point that the fact that someone else spoke about a topic does not mean a reference to that person renders the answer not directly relevant. So I would submit to you on this occasion, on the topic that has been asked about, Ms Ley is very relevant. The PRESIDENT: As I just indicated to Senator Hume, the minister has just started. I will continue to listen and, if the minister doesn't get to the substantive parts of the question, I will remind her. Senator GALLAGHER: Just to finish that, she said: 'I am not going to play, "Yes, this is good," or "No, this is bad," and rule in or rule out. I am not going to do that.' So it's alright for the opposition not to have to do it, but, for some reason, it's a game that they would like us to engage in. We have been very clear about the tax reform that we are bringing forward. It's a tax reform that those opposite support. We accept it must have killed them to adopt Labor tax policy. It must have killed them to accept that Labor's policy was better than theirs, reached more people than stage 3 and was a fairer way to distribute that money. Senator Hume: President, on relevance: you have given her another minute. She hasn't mentioned the words 'negative gearing'. That's what the question's about. The PRESIDENT: The minister is being directly relevant to your question. Senator GALLAGHER: We've been very clear on the tax reform the government is undertaking. We have changed our position on income tax. They have changed their position on income tax. We have brought forward some sensible measures around superannuation. We have brought forward some sensible measures around PRRT. We are bringing forward some measures around multinational tax reform. And you want to talk about all the things we are not doing, because you don't want to talk about the things we are doing, because you support the things we are doing. The PRESIDENT: Senator Hume, a first supplementary?