Senator CORMANN (Western Australia—Minister for Finance and the Public Service, Vice-President of the Executive Council and Leader of the Government in the Senate) (14:03): Again, the position of the government is very clear. What Senator Farrell is pointing to here is one of the great differences between the Liberal and National parties and the Labor Party. In the Labor Party, if somebody pulls out of line they get kicked out. But, of course, in the Liberal and National parties, we have freedom. We have a conscience. Backbenchers have got freedom— Opposition senators interjecting— The PRESIDENT: Order on my left! Senator CORMANN: Of course, every member of the Liberal and National parties is, of course, free to make a judgement on every vote. The member for Curtin was just stating the obvious. Senator Kim Carr interjecting— The PRESIDENT: Order, Senator Carr! Senator CORMANN: As a conscientious member of parliament, she makes the judgement. The member for Curtin was just making a statement of the obvious, and that is that, as a member of parliament, she makes a judgement, prior to every vote, on how she votes.