Senator BRANDIS (Queensland—Attorney-General, Vice-President of the Executive Council and Leader of the Government in the Senate) (14:16): Well, Senator Waters, you flatter me. You flatter me in thinking that I would be in a position to express a specialist opinion about this issue, because I am not. I am aware that the Chief Scientist has made that observation. I was watching him on the television during the interview which he gave. I am aware that the Chief Scientist's view is one among many on the issue of climate change. I am also aware, not being a scientist myself, that the preponderant view of most scientists is that global climate is rising and ought to be dealt with. That is why the Australian government at the Paris Climate Change Conference committed to the second most ambitious per capita targets of any G20 nation in terms of per capita emissions reduction, so that we will see emissions reduction of 26 to 28 per cent of 2005 levels by 2030. That is why we have adopted that policy—because we take this problem seriously. Unlike you, Senator Waters, our achievements are real achievements. They are not rhetorical flourishes; they are not achievements of rhetoric; they are achievements in terms of real outcomes. Senator Wong: Pollution going up is a real achievement! Senator BRANDIS: No, Senator Wong, not pollution going up; pollution going down 26 to 28 per cent of 2005 levels by 2030, which puts Australia at the very forefront of the nations of the world addressing this problem.