Senator SMITH (Western Australia) (15:25): Really, the surprise is that you should be surprised that people might be upset about some of the budget measures. And if you are surprised that people are surprised or upset about the budget measures, then that says one thing very, very clearly: that you do not think there is a problem. Australians fall into two camps at the moment—there is the camp that does not think there is a budget problem, represented by those people on that side of the chamber; then there are those of us on this side of the chamber, who do believe we have a budget problem. I understand completely. If people do not want to believe me— Senator Conroy interjecting— Senator SMITH: —if people do not want to believe Senator Conroy and Labor senators— The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Order on my left! Order! Senator Conroy: Get Henry Ergas out! Senator SMITH: I will get Phil Bowen, the Parliamentary Budget Officer, out—remembering, of course, that the Parliamentary Budget Office was established under Labor and the Greens. So what did the independent Parliamentary Budget Officer say when he was asked by a senator—it happened to be me—about very revealing— Senator Conroy interjecting— Senator SMITH: Senator Conroy, do you remember what Mr Bowen said? No—Senator Conroy would not remember what Mr Bowen said. Mr Bowen said that Australia's debt is increasing at the fastest rate of any OECD country. Senator Conroy interjecting— The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Order, Senator Conroy! Senator SMITH: And he stressed the need to reduce that debt to provide ourselves with a buffer against unexpected international economic— The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Senator Conroy—order Senator Smith. Senator SMITH: Why don't we go— The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Senator Conroy, that has been pretty continuous; your interjections are robust and very loud. Senator Smith is entitled to be heard in silence. Senator SMITH: I take it as a compliment that Senator Conroy should try that I not be heard. Let's have a look at what the International Monetary Fund had to say—not Senator Conroy, not Senator Smith; but what the International Monetary Fund had to say when it looked at our budget. It had to say: The government's aim to return the budget to surplus in the coming years will help rebuild fiscal buffers and increase the policy scope to deal with adverse shocks, but will be challenging in light of current social spending commitments. Cuts in projected spending and/or increased revenues are likely to be needed, and early decisions on policy changes required would help preserve policy flexibility. There is an element of this debate that has been missing for a long time. Australians know that the strong budget position that was left by the Howard government meant the next government could meet the challenges of the global financial crisis well. What we do not know is what economic calamity is around the corner. We do not know what the future looks like except that we do not have the capacity any more to respond to any economic calamity. That is a risk that this government thinks is too great to let go unaddressed. Let's have a look at what the secretary of the Treasury, Dr Parkinson, had to say. Senator Conroy, do you recall what Dr Parkinson had to say? No; Senator Conroy would want to erase it from his memory. On the need to reduce debt, Dr Parkinson told estimates: I have been saying this. The Governor of the Reserve Bank has been saying this. The head of the independent Parliamentary Budget Office has said this, most recently last week. If the two most senior economic bureaucrats in the country are saying, 'People, we have a challenge, and it's about time we had a serious community discussion' and the independent head of the Parliamentary Budget Office says the same thing, it is actually in the hands of the political class. So what the secretary of the Treasury means is that it is up to me; it is up to Senator Abetz, it is up to Senator Kroger, and— The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Senator Smith, I have to interrupt the debate now. The Senate will suspend until 5:30 pm to enable the presentation of the address-in-reply to His Excellency the Governor General at Government House. Sitting suspended from 15 : 30 to 17 : 30