Mr BOWEN (McMahon—Minister for Climate Change and Energy) (14:25): As I recall the question, it was about whether the cost in the $121 billion includes distribution. That was the question asked by the member for Fairfax. That was a very interesting question, because I have heard the Leader of the Opposition confuse 'transmission' and 'distribution' in the past. I thought: 'Oh, well, he's the leader; he's got to be across a lot of portfolios. He doesn't have to be across the detail.' We've just learned he's been ill advised by his shadow minister, because transmission is about the big interconnectors—the big interstate connections. Distribution is about poles and wires and telegraph poles in suburbs! Regardless of how the energy is generated, you still need telegraph poles and you still need wires in the street—unless this is a secret part of the plan we haven't been told about yet: if it's nuclear, you don't need telegraph poles. That's what the member for Fairfax is putting now! Apparently, they're not going to need to invest at all in poles and wires in the streets. We're not going to need any new telegraph poles in new suburbs, because it all comes from nuclear, all of a sudden. They don't need any in France, apparently. In France there are no telegraph poles! This is news! Good news! This is the new golden age, where we don't need any telegraph poles and we don't need any wires. The former member for Warringah, Tony Abbott, once said he was going to put them all underground in his electorate, but this is going one better: we don't need them at all! Now— Opposition members interjecting— The SPEAKER: Order! There's far too much noise on my left. I want to hear from the member for Fairfax on his one point of order, and he may have the call—and before the member makes his statement, he needs to be very clear, not adding additional statements in. He has the lead in the MPI today, so I want to be very clear that he is going to be strict with his point of order. We've had enough interruptions so far; we're going to deal with this in a respectful way. The member for Fairfax has the call. Mr Ted O'Brien: Thank you, Mr Speaker. My point of order is on relevance. The question went to whether or not the AEMO quoted figure of $121 billion included so much as one single cent of the cost for the required upgrades to Australia's— The SPEAKER: The member for Fairfax will resume his seat; he has raised his point of order. Mr Dutton interjecting— The SPEAKER: The Leader of the Opposition will cease interjecting. To assist the House, I'm going to ask the minister to return to the question, because I could not hear what he was saying. Mr BOWEN: The member for Fairfax underlines his misunderstanding that any investment in distribution is required whether the power comes from renewables, or coal, or gas or nuclear. It's the same; it's the same regardless of where the generation comes from. You still need telegraph poles. You still need wires. And the other interesting thing is that the member for Fairfax is now approvingly quoting AEMO, who he and the Leader of the Opposition have been bagging for months for daring to point out that renewables, firmed renewables, are the cheapest form of energy. AEMO will be releasing an updated ISP tomorrow, and I look forward to member for Fairfax criticising AEMO when they make similar points tomorrow. The SPEAKER: I give the call— Mr Bowen: Ask another one, Peter! The SPEAKER: The Minister for Climate Change and Energy is now warned! It's the same rules either side: no interruptions when I'm about to call a question, to show respect to the person asking the question. The member for Moreton has the call.