Dr MIKE KELLY (Eden-Monaro—Parliamentary Secretary for Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry) (15:19): I thank the member for Kennedy for his contribution, although I do wish to point out that we have a matter of public importance following immediately which deals with exactly the same subject. Technically speaking, a suspension of standing orders would be completely redundant in these circumstances. Obviously, the member for Kennedy has a passionate concern for the cattlemen in his region, as we all do. This is a very difficult and complicated issue and it is understandable that emotions are running high in response to the footage that we all saw on the Four Corners report, the footage that has given rise to a great deal of concern in the community. There are many sides to this argument as well, as we understand the impact that this issue has on our farmers and graziers not only in the Northern Territory but also in the member for Kennedy's backyard. I understand the passion with which he is trying to defend his industry. It is very important that we support our farmers, but it is also essential that we come up with a solution that gives certainty about how Australian animals are being treated all through the chain of supply and all through this process. We know that these circumstances have caused great damage to the industry, but it has gone beyond just the exporters of live animals to Indonesia; it has also had ramifications and repercussions for the rest of the meat industry in this country. We have noticed that there has been a falling-off in purchases from butchers. This footage has certainly played havoc with the entire meat market. We do not have the luxury to mess around and come up with the wrong answer to this situation. We must very carefully plot a course through this situation and come up with parameters that will make sure that we do not see a repetition of this situation. If we were to rush to a solution now and create a short-term fix that then rebounded on us later with a fault in the system, where would that leave our industry, our market and our cattlemen? We cannot afford a repetition of this incident. We must ensure that we put in place a system that has certainty for the future of the industry and consumers. Of course, we had the contribution from the member for Wide Bay this morning who thinks we can come up with a short-term fix to this problem. He thinks that we can implement an identification system in a day. I note that when he had responsibility for this issue, it took him 21 months to implement that for this country. I also note that, following the member for Wide Bay's comments on radio this morning, Mr Rob Gillam, President of the Pastoralists and Graziers Association of Western Australia, made nonsense of that claim that it could be done in a day. In his view, it would take many weeks just to put the identification system in place. We have to recognise that we are dealing with another country—Indonesia—which needs capacity built to be able to deal with this situation and which needs technical solutions put in place to complement an identification system. And, of course, we have to work through that as a matter of diplomacy as well. That is something I know that the opposition do not seem to know much about when it comes to the relationship with Indonesia. We have rebuilt our relationship with Indonesia since this government came into office, and it is a relationship that certainly needed a lot of repair. I remember very well when I was an officer in the army and the Minister for Defence at the time, Mr Moore, claimed he was going to send troops across the border into West Timor, regardless of what Indonesian opinion was then. I remember the outrage that that caused in Indonesia. Over the years, we have seen some incredible damage done to our relationship with Indonesia through the opposition's ignorance and poor performance in diplomacy. So that aspect needs to be handled with care. We have seen constructive engagement from the Indonesian authorities on this issue. They are as concerned as we are that their practices and processes are in accordance with their own welfare laws in this respect. Our engagement has been across the relevant portfolios. The Minister for Foreign Affairs, the Minister for Trade and the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry have engaged with their counterparts and they have an understanding that something does need to be done. As I say, they will require technical assistance to put those procedures in place. Mr Katter: You've been telling us that, Mike, for nine years. Dr MIKE KELLY: The member for Kennedy has rightly pointed out that an inquiry needs to happen. He also points out that nothing has happened in nine years. Of course, this government has only been in office since 2007. The member for Kennedy also pointed out that this issue goes back many, many years to the previous government, the Howard government, when this trade was also conducted. Twelve years was plenty of time for the government to go and have a look for themselves at what was going on in Indonesia. What did they do during that time? They did diddly-squat, not a thing. In contrast to that, this government have been actively engaged in pursuing this issue. Well before it emerged on Four Corners, the minister was engaged in correspondence with the industry. On 30 May the government's veterinary services were engaged to examine the standards that were being applied in the treatment of our livestock. We are actively engaged in trying to deal with this situation. Of course, now, Mr Farmer has been appointed to conduct an inquiry on behalf of the government. Mr Farmer has had a lot of experience in dealing with Indonesia as a former ambassador. We can rely on him to the deal with this situation. He has a relationship with Indonesia. Mr Farmer will conduct an inquiry not only into this issue but into the breadth and depth of our entire live export industry, which is what is required right now. We need certainty across the board so that we can preserve the live export industry for this nation. It is so important for us. It is important for our revenue and important for our domestic agriculture industry. There are those who want to shut this industry down and there are those who would like a permanent blanket prohibition. Those cries will continue to be made whenever there is evidence that this industry is not being conducted on a sound footing. Where images appear that allow people to make that kind of argument, this industry will suffer damage. It is important that we get this right across the live export industry and that is what Mr Farmer will do. We have not introduced a suspension into this industry mandatorily on a six-month basis; we have said we will get this industry back up and running and back exporting as soon as it is possible to do so, as soon as we have certainty. It is not a case of just getting animals and going back into the abattoirs in Indonesia that we know meet the right standards; it is about making sure that our livestock are going to those abattoirs. You cannot just hope that they will go to those abattoirs; you need to have a tracking system that ensures that. That will deliver certainty for our growers who have inundated us with calls concerned about how their animals are being treated. They do not want this industry started up again unless they can be satisfied that their animals will be treated in a proper manner. Their concern has been directed at the way in which the Meat and Livestock Association have dealt with this issue, and the funds that have gone their way which, of course, have also received matching funding from the Commonwealth. MLA have dropped the ball. There is no question about that. And that is why the minister is demanding the MLA support farmers in this time of need. They will be required to do that. This government will make sure that they do that because we have the future of our farmers at heart. We are determined to look after them and preserve this industry. But we must have a technical system that will allow us to completely track our animals through the system so that we can be certain that they are going to the abattoirs that can deal with these animals correctly. If we do it otherwise then this industry will collapse. We cannot afford a second instance of this kind. That is the negligence that is being demonstrated by the members on the other side, particularly the member for Wide Bay, who ought to know better. He claims he knows the primary industry and says he can get this industry going in a day. What an absurd proposition. No member of this industry would back up that claim. No-one who knows what they are talking about could in their right mind assert that you could get this going in a day. No-one who has had any contact with the cattle industry could assert that that was the case. He has been exposed as an impostor. The SPEAKER: Order! The time allotted for the debate has concluded. The question is that the motion moved by the member for Kennedy for the suspension of standing and sessional orders be agreed to. The House divided. [15:34] (The Speaker—Mr Harry Jenkins) In division— The SPEAKER: I remind members that the use of phones for voice messages in the chamber is very disorderly. The use of phones as cameras is also considered disorderly. I have adopted the attitude that in the first instance I would give people a chance, and I have usually had the cooperation of whips to ensure that that happens. Of course the unwhipped, those on the crossbenches, are a different challenge. I would hope that they recognise that they need to be very careful about the use of their mobile phones certainly if they wish to vote on motions they have moved. The requirements of standing order 47(c)(ii) for an absolute majority having not been satisfied, the motion was not carried.