Senator WILLIAMS (New South Wales—Nationals Whip in the Senate) (15:09): You hear everything in this place, don't you? You hear everything. The carbon tax we were never going to have, which we abolished, actually brought the prices down substantially when it was abolished. Senator Farrell: You don't believe that. Senator WILLIAMS: Have a look at the graphs of the wholesale prices. You do not believe the prices and you do not believe the facts. Senator O'Neill interjecting— Senator WILLIAMS: Well, the first thing you learn, love, is that you cannot educate idiots. That is a fact. But I am surprised that Senator O'Neill did not say, 'Let's come straight on the answers to the questions of Senator Cash.' You know, the one about the $27,000 donation of AustralianSuper to the AWU? Who was involved in AustralianSuper? One Mr Bill Shorten, the Leader of the Opposition. Who was tied up with the AWU? One Mr Bill Shorten, the AWU boss at the time. He was very involved with Paul Howes as well. Of course, who was the candidate running for parliament? Mr Bill Shorten. Where did the money flow? Ten years later, we change the reason for the donation. Give us a break. We will not harp on that. We will go back to the energy situation. I do not mind renewable energy; I am a supporter of renewable energy. That is one condition: it stands on its own. Senator Farrell is here from South Australia, where I grew up. I spent my first 25 years there in South Australia. Senator Farrell: You should have stayed. Senator WILLIAMS: No, I enjoy electricity. I like to turn the switch and the light stays on, and it does not go into darkness. I am not regretting leaving the dark state 25 years ago. In fact, there was a sign at Broken Hill, up there at Cockburn, when you went across the border: 'Last one out, please turn off the lights.' That was a sign when you left South Australia. You do not have to worry about turning off lights; they just went off automatically with the lack of electricity. Here are the wind turbines. You put a wind turbine. It produces three megawatt hours. So what is the subsidy? Well, one megawatt hour is a renewable energy certificate, making $70 or $80. A three megawatt wind turbine means three certificates an hour, eight hours a day, 365 days a year. Multiply that by $70 or $80 and what have you got? You have got a $7,000-a-year subsidy to the wind turbine. That is for one. Of course, they are all over where I grew up at Jamestown. It was everywhere. A $7,000 subsidy for each tower. But who pays for it? I will tell you who pays for it: the poor widow who is living on her own as a pensioner. It goes onto her power bill, because the coal fired generators have to buy the renewable energy certificates. What happens? Then the wind turbines can sell electricity cheap because they are getting so much subsidy. I am sure that Senator Farrell would be aware of a place call Port Augusta, 200 miles north of Adelaide. You ever been there? Senator Farrell: I know it well. I have got some relatives there. Senator WILLIAMS: Yes. What happened to the coal fired generator there? It was shut down. It was going broke. Why was going broke? It was because of the subsidies we throw at the wind turbines. Of course, we then see South Australia become not only the driest state in the driest continent but the darkest state in Australia as well. That is because the lights are going out, and aren't the people annoyed about it? I was in South Australia last Monday and they are very annoyed. When you talk to businesses down there, they are very annoyed. They want to go into the manufacture of our submarines—$50 billion worth. They won the award. I hope you have enough electricity to actually make the submarines. That would be a big worry. What we are doing is having a debate because of the Finkel report. We are allowed to debate that. Over on your side, you do as you are told. I wonder if Senator Farrell supports same-sex marriage. Well, he will say publicly that he does. I wonder if Senator O'Neill does? Knowing their background and their beliefs, I doubt if they would. They are doing as they are told. They are in the party of dictatorship. You do as you are told or you get kicked out. You cannot cross the floor over there. Even Senator Sahaad Dastyari—that is his name, Senator Sahaad— Senator Dastyari: Sahand. Senator WILLIAMS: I had a quiz the other day that said to me, 'Can you give us a question for a quiz round night?' I said, 'The question is: what is the Christian name of Senator Dastyari? The answer: Sahand.' I do not know if they got the quiz right that night, but anyway. Thanks for confirming if I have pronounced it right or wrong. So those from the party of dictatorship, where you do as you are told, you just do as you are told and keep going. On our side of the politics, in the Liberal-National party, we are actually having a debate. We are having a discussion. We have got a report. We are sorting out what is the best. We have been in the party room for hours, working out what is the best situation to guarantee supply, to reduce costs and to do the right thing. That is because the situation we face is simple: if we do not have cheap, reliable electricity, we will not have manufacturing and we will not have jobs. We will not have anything. Everything will be moved overseas. That is the situation, and we will stick by it.