Senator SIEWERT (Western Australia—Australian Greens Whip) (14:52): If you cannot give me the precise figures, surely you will have a bit of an understanding about whether there has been an increase in demand for legal aid for the number of people who are having to appear before the AAT to appeal against being kicked off DSP or dropped onto Newstart. You must have an idea about whether that demand has increased, because I have been told anecdotally that there has been an increase.