Senator JACINTA COLLINS (Victoria) (15:09): I move: That the Senate take note of the answers given by the Attorney-General (Senator Brandis) to questions without notice asked by Senators Collins and Conroy today relating to the Commissioner of the Royal Commission into Trade Union Governance and Corruption. Given that Senator Abetz denied me leave, I will address some of the matters I would have raised earlier in taking note of answers to questions from me and Senator Conroy. Senator Ian Macdonald: Why don't you make it Senator Wong too? Senator JACINTA COLLINS: Mr Deputy President, I hope that my time will not incorporate lengthy interjections such as those from Senator Ian MacDonald. The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: It probably will not. Senator JACINTA COLLINS: Thank you very much. I have reflected in both yesterday's question time and today's that when the government is in serious difficulty we see it coming forward with the insults. Yesterday it was reported that in the discussions related to questions about Commissioner Heydon— Senator Ian Macdonald: You're not insulting Dyson Heydon? What double standards! Senator JACINTA COLLINS: My question to Senator Brandis yesterday did not insult Commissioner Heydon. It sought some straightforward information that the government has been seeking to conceal for quite some time. Instead, in his conditional withdrawal Senator Brandis claimed that I uttered words attacking Commissioner Heydon. This is simply untrue. I invite all senators to review the Hansard of yesterday's question time. I did not hear what Senator Brandis said in question time yesterday because of all of the noise in the chamber. I thank the President for his comments this morning to that effect. On reviewing the Hansard I saw that I had been described as 'dishonest and sleazy', which is disgraceful. I will not repeat today the words that Senator Payne described as inaudible, because they were obviously heard. The point is the insults that this government is coming forward with to try to conceal its fragile political status. Why is it fragile? It is fragile because the Prime Minister, Mr Abbott, has put his trust in the judgement of people such as Senator Brandis to make balanced decisions on who should conduct a royal commission. We see now from answers to questions today that Senator Brandis did not have an appropriate process for determining someone. He had no short list. The cabinet had no short list. He picked Commissioner Heydon. He claims it was on the basis that he wanted 'the best black-letter lawyer'. I do not know that being a black-letter lawyer is necessarily the best criterion for someone to look into complex workplace relations matters and the behaviour of registered organisations. However, I can understand that Senator Brandis would be happy to have a capital-C conservative lawyer, which is what I understand a black-letter lawyer to be. Let us look at the other point that I raised in questions today, which is about the secrecy— Senator Ian Macdonald: This is the guy that Bob Carr appointed. The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Order, Senator MacDonald! Senator Ian Macdonald: I cannot follow her argument. The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: That is not a matter for me. What is a matter for me is interjections which are disorderly. I am calling you to order. Senator JACINTA COLLINS: The other issue I raised today was not an attack but a question about the costs involved in the royal commission. What were we told by Senator Brandis today in answer to that? 'It's a matter of form. We don't provide information such as this on costs.' Yesterday he could not tell us whether it was a special circumstance that he personally had approved. We are still waiting for that answer. Today he cannot tell us why we can get information about the costs involved for counsel assisting, Mr Stoljar, but we cannot get the information—other than through cabinet leaks—that might be relevant to the costs of Commissioner Heydon. We need to understand the full costs of this exercise. This royal commission is turning into a farce. The secrecy, the lack of transparency and the decision-making processes demonstrated by this government are the issue. I have not attacked Commissioner Heydon, but I am attacking the way this government has dealt with this matter.